BrandSavant

Gaining Insight From Social Media Data

What Klout Really Measures

by Tom Webster on June 27, 2012

I haven’t touched upon influence measures in this space for a while, but after a bit of a brainstorm this morning, I think I’ve finally put my finger on just exactly what things like Klout, Kred and PeerIndex are measuring, and how a smart marketer can use these measures to actually do something worthwhile.

I’ve been skeptical of these services here in the past (note: that’s skeptical, not cynical) because they don’t actually do what they say they do. Klout, “The Standard Of Influence,” does not measure influence and never has. Because of that, it’s easy to be dismissive of the entire category of influence measures with their ridiculously reductive “scores” and easily-gamed mechanics. Influence is swaying someone else to produce a change in state, and there is no demonstrable evidence that a higher Klout score gives you that magical power. Let’s stipulate that, and move on.

The fact is, however, that influence scores measure something. The smartest thing I’ve heard on the matter is from my friend Mark Schaefer, who posits that influence scores measure your ability to move content–to spread a message throughout “the system.” I think that’s a pretty good read on the “what” of influence measures. I’m equally interested, however, in the “how” and the “why,” and for that, I turned to the dark recesses of my shameful past.

You see, before I started my market research career, got my MBA and my statistical training, I was an English teacher. In fact, I was a lecturer in Rhetoric and Composition for two years at Penn State, where I taught incoming Freshmen how to frame an argument and convince their readers to adopt or consider a certain viewpoint. You know, influence. The study of Rhetoric predates the development of Klout by, well, more than a few years, and stems from the teachings of Aristotle (now, do bear with me, here.) Aristotle posited that there were three specific appeals that a writer or speaker could make in order to sway their audience, and those appeals are still taught in rhetoric/composition courses to this day.

These are the three appeals: Ethos, the argument from the author’s credibility; Pathos, an appeal to the emotions of the audience; and Logos, or an appeal to the audience’s sense of logic and reason. Writers who skillfully weave Ethos, Pathos and Logos (and also starring Orlando Bloom as the hot-headed D’Artagnan!) stand the best chance of swaying their audience to change their state.

I believe that what “influence measures” are working towards is this: a quantification of Ethos. They aren’t there yet, but they are iterating rapidly. And I can buy a Klout score as a representation of Ethos, especially if they would finally get around to applying these scores to individual topics. But Ethos alone is insufficient. What all of these scores fail to measure–indeed, cannot measure–is the effect of the message itself. After all, Jay Baer might have a Klout score in the 70′s, but if he tweets “Hey, everybody–let’s go club some baby seals!” you’ll see right quick that Ethos alone won’t get you that new sealskin coat you’ve been jonesing for.

What this means to marketers who are crafting “influencer” campaigns is this: use Klout/Kred/PeerIndex et al as a first pass to identify the messengers, but know that even nailing that is barely accomplishing one third of what you need to do to actually sway people.

What’s left is the hard part: first, crafting the message that you want the influencer to deliver, and if you are doing the work, that’s an influencer-specific message. That’s the Logos. Equally important, however, is getting the influencer to engage with that message–and that’s the Pathos. I’ve had my own experiences with influencer campaigns, and here is something you can take to the bank: if all you are getting from your “influencer” is a retweet, that and 4 bucks will get you a latte.

If you can engage the influencer’s passions, and work with them to craft a compelling logical appeal, then you can leverage the credibility of the influencer to actually sway hearts and minds. Otherwise, you’re just piling up metrics like mentions and retweets that might be proxies for nothing.

Of course, this means that you need to stop thinking about Influencer marketing as a “push” campaign, and more about a partnership with the right influencers. Logos, Pathos AND Ethos will get you pretty far.

Finally, no seals were harmed in the making of this blog post.

Be Sociable, Share!
  • http://www.jasonkonopinski.com/ Jason Konopinski

    My braincrush on you deepens, Webster. I taught composition and literature to college freshmen during my graduate school days at George Mason. :)  

  • http://twitter.com/Leslie_A_Lewis Leslie A. Lewis

    I have to say, as a Political Theory major in my undergrad, I am very happy to see that you worked Aristotle’s Rhetoric into a post about Klout!

    I’ve subscribed to Mark’s views on what influence measures actually measure as well.  I agree that they measure quantity not quality of the reach. 

    In your example re: clubbing seals, 400 RTs may appear to be influential, but how many of those 400 actually went out and clubbed baby seals.  If your telos (look at me putting my undergrad to work!) is to raise awareness of the awesomeness of clubbing baby seals then Jay Baer and his influence has helped you accomplish that.  If your goal is to actually have people go out and club baby seals (praxis if you will), then measuring Jay’s influence on behavior change is more difficult to quantify and this is where Klout et al. fails.

    With apologies to baby seals and Jay Baer.

  • http://www.edisonresearch.com Tom Webster

    Thank you, Leslie, for a thoughtful – albeit violent – reply. :)

  • http://twitter.com/jfgen Jorge Encarnação

    Well written article. Very good clarification. While I still argue that people should weight how much importance they give to Klout,  I can see the benefits of using such metrics to check their “credibility” within their network.

  • http://www.edisonresearch.com Tom Webster

    Shhhh. Don’t admit that too readily, Konopinski.

  • http://www.edisonresearch.com Tom Webster

    Thanks, Jorge. These measures don’t do what they say they do. But they do *something*. This was a humble stab at what that something might become.

  • http://twitter.com/tridence David Vega

    well done. 

  • http://twitter.com/buzzbishop Buzz Bishop

    How many times did you use that Three Musketeers joke in lectures? Awesome.

    Thanks for the brain food.

  • http://twitter.com/KellyeCrane Kellye Crane

    Tom- I’ve been pondering this thought-provoking post all day (thanks for killing my productivity!).  I respectfully disagree with some of the characterizations, but agree with your conclusion.

    In my view, these tools rely far too heavily on level of activity, and therefore don’t measure a person’s ability to spread a message (singular), though they do show ability to move content (e.g., total shares of multiple messages). I believe that as long as they reward chattiness, they’re actually diluting their ability to measure Ethos (certainly real influence, as you define it above).

    Obviously, one’s ability to influence others doesn’t go down just because you took a vacation. And as you note, a share from an over-sharer doesn’t get you very far.

    So, I think Klout and the like are best used as a first pass to identify the most active voices in a given space. Then, we can look at who is influencing *them* – who are the main thought leaders that the high-scoring active people are sharing (hint: Tom, you are one of these people). Klout also rewards elitism (at least as it relates to the Klout scores of those you’re speaking to), so that has to be considered in the analysis, as well.

    Sometimes these true influencers have a high Klout score, sometimes they don’t. But, as you point out, it’s old fashioned research and relationship building that’s going to actually get people what they want.

    (just realized how long this comment is – hope that’s OK!)

  • http://twitter.com/webby2001 Tom Webster

    Pretty much EVERY TIME.

  • http://twitter.com/webby2001 Tom Webster

    It’s more than OK, Kellye–it’s fantastic. Thank you for sharing the gift of your considered opinion on this. You’ve clearly spent some time thinking about this issue (probably more than I have!)

  • http://twitter.com/KellyeCrane Kellye Crane

     You’re too kind! Your post is what got me thinking in some new and interesting directions (as always).

  • http://www.kennedypittman.com/ Kennedy Pittman

    This is my gut more than data speaking, so be warned – ignorance ahead. But I’ve always been skeptical of the influencer-chasing model. All that effort seems better directed at making a stand out product that will naturally attract the right kind of influencer. 

    For example, Justin Beiber told all his followers to follow Matt Lauer on Twitter. Matt instantly gets 40k followers. How much do you really think that helped Matt though? This is like the best case scenario for piggybacking on someone’s influence, and it just seems like a waste. These people don’t suddenly care about Matt Lauer now. 

    But if you build your product right, the right people care and share. Engage the people who deeply care, whether influencer or not. Educate them, hold their interest, evoke some mystery. These will be your ambassadors. They won’t all be Beiber or Brogan, but they will reach their community deeper rather than wider.

  • ReaderX

    I’ve been both skeptical about what these systems offer and cynical about the way they market themselves. I think you’ve really got a good working theory here and I’m pleased to begin looking at this through the EPL prism. Insightful epiphany!

    Perhaps we can change influencers to carriers. People likely to carry your message. We’re not creating influencer campaigns and never have been, but reframing the effort as cultivating carriers makes a lot more sense.

  • Kjell Kallman

    Tom – insightful and enjoyable post. I always learn something when I read your blog. For what it is worth, my Klout score moved five points in one day last week…. it was my birthday and I responded in someway to everyone who took the time to post a birthday wish on my Facebook page … I suppose I an now “influential in frosting.”

  • http://Social-Tango.com Billy Delaney

    Tom you remove the emotion from the argument and slice the logic nicely. Best thing I’ve read on this subject, by far! quit the background to support your insights too. All the best sir!

  • http://www.edisonresearch.com Tom Webster

    Thanks, Billy! Appreciate your dropping by and reading.

  • http://twitter.com/MoreyAAltman Morey A. Altman

    Tom,
    The whole piece was worth reading just for the Three Musketeers joke. And I respect anyone who can slip a Greek philosopher into an article on an internet tool. Look, these kids have to learn somewhere. As for the content, you’re 100% dead……on. Ha, made you nervous, didn’t I? But I think we’re a minority. A lot of agencies are blinded by the Klout score above all else, which is nuts. When it comes right down to it, I want to be retweeted by the account with 1,000,000 followers  not the guy or gal with a Klout score of 62 and 1,500 followers. Klout is an influence tool worth looking at, but it tells – as you’ve said – only part of the story. There’s a much better influence tool just waiting to be discovered. Maybe it will be Klout 2.0? Maybe I’ll create one myself. Hmmmm….pathos, you say? That’s just τρελός enough to work. @moreyaaltman:twitter

  • http://twitter.com/brandone Brandon Evans

    Tom, nice post. I generally agree though I think it is worth noting that while these scores can help understand the spread of content, the impressions generated by high scoring people with lots of followers should be looked at like paid media is, as pure impressions. 

    The value of person to person social marketing however is based upon a greater level of trust. So, to drive someone to purchase something at a grocery store, try new fashion or see a movie, this is typically coming from what we describe as peer influencers. People, in your close circle actually influence a person’s purchasing behavior most so that is really what marketers should be focusing on. Here is a nice infographic we created and Mashable covered on the subject, it also links to our full white paper, The Power of Peer Influence. http://mashable.com/2012/06/13/influence-marketing-infographic/

  • http://twitter.com/dannyhanssel Dan Hanssel

    I am duly impressed. Rarely does one see such an erudite essay on what is still an esoteric topic IRL. It’s said no one outside social media knows or cares what Klout is. That aside, I think both Tom and 
    Mark Schaefer,  are spot on in their analyses. Even if one of these influence metrics captures Ethos, they have a long way to get to Pathos and Logos.

    Nice job, Tom

  • http://www.edisonresearch.com Tom Webster

    Thank you, Dan–very kind. “erudite and esoteric” are kinda part of the brand here ;)

  • http://www.3hatscommunications.com/blog/ davinabrewer

    What @twitter-14465113:disqus said. 

    Actually Tom, I’m filing this one away, for the next time I tackle ye olde ‘influence’ debate. Think I’ve drafted and deleted twice as many posts as I’ve published, still not sure of where I stand on influencer targeting, social scoring, never mind what influence really is.

    Mark’s right: getting people to ‘move’ something, not everyone can do that – and that really is something. Mark could write bollocks, get 100 RTs just w/ having his name attached; I couldn’t get 10 w/ the Magna Carta. (No wonder, that’s probably a dull read.) But I’m not sure it’s always ‘influence’ so much as relationship building, or self-interests. I mean if you’re targeting influencers, what better way to curry favor? 

    Kellye’s right: most of these algorithms crunch numbers. They measure activity, count followers, look at ratios. But until they measure follow-thru (action beyond the click, did anyone read? donate? do more than click a repost button?) and sentiment (does this action indicate a change in thinking, belief?), it’s going to take more to identify – and build campaigns – around true thought influencers.

    As to influence itself – you’re right, it is absolutely about changing hearts and minds, about action. I know of a few people that it means change that carries over to the offline world too. I think my best example is this: Retailers may court me, marketers may woo me, social types may tweet me to the water .. but they can’t make me buy a PC. When someone gets me to leave Apple, that would be real influence (which may or may not be sign of the next Apocalypse). FWIW.

  • http://www.muellerandrew.com/ andrewmueller

    Tom,

    I agree 100% that Klout et al do not measure what they say they measure.  I would also posit that if they create an algorithm to measure influence and they are really measuring distribution potential, they either have a complete ignorance of the difference between these two things or are deliberately deceptive.

    Regardless,  the important to most marketers is that these influence measures DO NOT measure the potential that any given “messenger” has in reaching and influencing their target audience(s). This is because influence resides in domain. Barak Obama may have the ability to influence a great deal of people on aspects of national security but relatively little little influence over what music to listen to. Distribution potential is worthless if the message is being delivered to the wrong people.

    I think you touch upon this in your discussion of ethos, pathos, and logos. Thank you for that! Your suggestion to hone in on influencers who are aligned with your values, passions, and  message who can reach your target audiences in an engaging way….now that is something of real worth.

  • http://www.facebook.com/vanwouw Neil Van Wouw

    Best article I’ve seen on Klout yet. Well done!

  • http://www.businessesGROW.com/blog Mark W Schaefer

    Thanks for taking the discussion to a new level but I disagree with the thought that you need all three to be influential. We have now left the carbon-based wolrd and online, mere social proof like number of Twitter followers or yes, a Klout score, is enough to garner attention and credibility. We are in an influence do-loop.

    If you are right that Klout = ethos and I am right that ethos alone represents influence for many people on the web, then Klout score = influence.

    Whether we like it or not.

  • http://twitter.com/webby2001 Tom Webster

    If you are Justin Bieber or Barack Obama, then Ethos is all you need, but I submit that for the rest of us, some combination of the three rhetorical appeals is necessary to actually get me to do something you want me to do. Maybe I am applying a more dogmatic definition of “influence” here, but I think Ethos alone buys you a retweet. If that’s all you want–great. But I think you are making a leap here that attention and credibility = influence. Those might get me to notice you–and yes, Mark, I notice you more than I notice most online, and your Klout score probably reflects that. But, in this specific instance, you didn’t influence me ;)  
    It might be interesting for you to review your most–and least–successful attempts to influence others online. If we assume that your ethos/Klout has been steady over the past, say, six months, then any variance in the success or failure of individual efforts over that time to sway, dissuade or even spread content is accountable by something else–the message.  Which Klout can’t measure.

  • http://Social-Tango.com Billy Delaney

    Tom you remove the emotion from the argument and slice the logic nicely. Best thing I’ve read on this subject, by far! quit the background to support your insights too. All the best sir!

  • http://Social-Tango.com Billy Delaney

    Becoming a regular.
    Don’t always comment because so many already have and they often state my views or feelings. 
    But…
    This the content here is sooooo good. Thanks

  • Pingback: Ski Resorts and Klout: Should You Even Care About This Often Ridiculed Score? : Ski Resort Marketing - SlopeFillers.com

  • Pingback: Top Influencer Marketing News: Measuring Influence - Appinions

  • trufflemedia

    LOL, thanks Tom:)  Your thoughts on this have certainly influenced me:) 

    Now I am trying to image you teaching freshmen Rhetoric and Composition!

  • http://twitter.com/LizJostes Liz Jostes

    I love every bit of what Kellye Crane wrote. Also, I think that “reward chattiness” is a great way to explain what I see in some who (work very hard to) have a high Klout score. For example, there are some Twitter users in my local market who automatically retweet anything coming out of “important” Twitter accounts and news sources. 
    Really what those few are doing is adding a lot of noise to the stream without adding any true engagement. Yet, they are “rewarded” with higher influence scores.

  • Pingback: Influencer Marketing Quotes of the Week – Influencer Marketing Review

  • Pingback: Klout vs Kred – Social Influence Comparison

  • http://www.socialears.com/ Mwillaman

    This is a really excellent post. Thank you.

    Our company’s software analyzes social conversations in order to identify the people that are most “influential” for respective topics. Really hard stuff and we struggle with many of the themes discussed in your blog post.  

    One thing we’ve discovered is that you have to first ‘listen’ to these social conversations in order to accurately quantify the “Ethos” of the participants or to begin “weaving Ethos, Pathos and Logos” into your own social content. And we’ve also concluded that listening takes a lot of effort!! Making it more challenging is the fact that effective listening requires more than scanning only the social updates (e.g., the 140 characters in a Tweet) – and if your participation in conversations is primarily through the use of automated curration tools (which seems to increasingly be the norm for many people) then it will be very hard to build influence over time.  

    We’re so early in understanding what online influence is, how to measure it and how to get it but your relating it to Logos, Pathos and Ethos is brilliant in it’s simplicity.  The hard port is in the execution. Thanks for the thought provoking post.

    BTW – funny story on Klout.  Your readers may appreciate this blog post by one of our company’s staff members titled, “Klout is My Frenemy. Going from Nobody to Influencer in One Day.” 

    http://hrmarketer.blogspot.com/2012/06/klout-is-my-frenemy-going-from-nobody.html

    Mark Willaman
    CEO, SocialEars

  • http://v3im.com/ Shelly Kramer.

    And this is why I love @andrewmueller:disqus . Influence is great if all you’re measuring is distribution potential. But what Klout sells – or at least what I believe they sell to brands is connecting them with influencers who will, purportedly influence a buying decision with regard to their product or service.

    I’ve been seeing posts from recent “Kloutfluentials” about their stay at an upscale resort, pics from poolside and lots of cavorting. The question is not whether these folks (who are mostly nothing more than heavy Twitter users) are having fun – of course they are. The bigger question, and the one I, as a marketer, care about is this — is anybody buying anything as a result.

    In large part, my guess is the answer is no. 

    Sometimes the strongest, most influential brand advocates – the people who actually inspire people to action, to purchase, to DO are people with low Klout scores but with highly engaged personal communities. That “magic middle” is pretty doggone powerful.

    I wanted to like Klout, from the early days. I think Joe Fernandez is a great guy. I think influence measurement, to some degree, is very important. But more than measuring influence, we (marketers anyway) need to understand what consequence it is we’re aiming for when we identify and/or engage influencers. If it’s gathering leads and converting leads to sales …. is Klout really working? I’d love to know more.

    Thanks Webby, for always inspiring thought.

  • Pingback: Klout vs Kred – Social Influence Comparison | SNID- Master in Social Networks Influence Design

  • http://twitter.com/LoveStats Annie Pettit

    I noticed you didn’t mention Flout.com. If you check there, my highly acclaimed flout 56478. I know you’re jealous.

  • Pingback: Klout = Krap? « rsmithing

  • Gregory Garvin

    I think Klout still has many flaws based on the social networks assumed numbers. Facebook is the biggest factor. I know this bc i closed fb and some friends who have less redistributed content have higher scores being only on 2 social networks -facebook & Twitter. Meanwhile Im on multiple social network sites actively with no Facebook.

    There was good discussion in a weekly Hootsuite #HSUChat on Twitter about a month ago.

  • http://twitter.com/GaryDayEllison Gary Day-Ellison

    Good to see thoughts, concepts and ideas from outside Social Media and Marketing-speak. Well said.

  • Pingback: What Successful Brands Know that You Don’t: Leveraging Bloggers for Better Branding | Adventure Travel News

  • Pingback: What Klout Really Measures | BrandSavant « Ginacarr’s Weblog

  • Pingback: Grains of viral marketing influence - Christopher S. Penn : Awaken Your Superhero

  • Pingback: Influence is irrelevant @ The Wayward Celt

  • Pingback: Influence is irrelevant | AcdntlPoet's Blog

Previous post:

Next post: